Synopsis: Join Laura Flanders and notable activists in a roundtable discussion analyzing the implications of the historic 2024 presidential election results. Descubre perspectivas únicas en el análisis post-elección con Guerline Jozef, Judith LeBlanc y Serena Sebring. Analizan el impacto para personas, planeta y democracia que no encontrarás en los medios tradicionales. Short Description: What are the takeaways from this historic presidential race, as well as critical local races and ballot initiatives? Laura Flanders & Friends presents an exclusive post-election roundtable discussion, featuring analysts and perspectives you won’t find in the money media. Join Laura and her guests as they examine what lies ahead for people, the planet and democracy. Where do we go from here? Guests: • Guerline Jozef: Founder & Executive Director, The Haitian Bridge Alliance • Judith LeBlanc (Caddo Nation): Executive Director, Native Organizers Alliance • Serena Sebring: Executive Director, Blueprint NC Full Conversation Release: While our weekly shows are edited to time for broadcast on Public TV and community radio, we offer to our members and podcast subscribers the full uncut conversation. The following is from our episode "Where Do We Go From Here? Frontline Activists Talk Election ‘24 Takeaways." These audio exclusives are made possible thanks to our member supporters. Become a supporting member at https://LauraFlanders.org/Donate
Descpription: Tens of millions of Americans cast their ballots in one of the most divisive elections in our lifetime, but what happens next? What are the teachings and takeaways from this historic presidential race, as well as critical local races and ballot initiatives? Laura Flanders & Friends presents an exclusive post-election roundtable discussion, featuring analysts and perspectives you won’t find in the money media. They include Guerline Jozef, a Haitian-American human rights advocate and Founder & Executive Director of The Haitian Bridge Alliance, called one of the “Most Influential People on Race, Politics, and Policy in the United States”; Judith LeBlanc, a citizen of the Caddo Nation and Executive Director of the Native Organizers Alliance; and Serena Sebring, Executive Director of Blueprint NC, a progressive ecosystem of nearly 60 groups working to build inclusive democracy in North Carolina. Join Laura and her guests as they examine what lies ahead for people, the planet and democracy. Where do we go from here? This conversation was recorded the morning of November 6, 2024.
Guests:
• Guerline Jozef: Founder & Executive Director, The Haitian Bridge Alliance
• Judith LeBlanc (Caddo Nation): Executive Director, Native Organizers Alliance
• Serena Sebring: Executive Director, Blueprint NC
• What’s On The Ballot In North Carolina? Abortion, Trans Life, A Governorship, & Multiracial Democracy, Watch / Podcast
• Reporting on Policing at the Polls & BIPOC Voter Suppression in 2024, Watch / Podcast / Full Conversation
• Not Party to Party Politics: Movement Leaders Consider Election ‘24, Watch / Podcast / Full Conversation
• Haitian group in Springfield, Ohio, files citizen criminal charges against Trump and Vance, by Julie Carr Smyth, September 25, 2024, Associate Press
• Why more Native Americans are on U.S. ballots than ever before, by Ximena Bustillo for Morning Edition, November 3, 2024, NPR-WAMU
• Bidenomics Is Starting to Transform America. Why Has No One Noticed? By Nicholas Lemann, October 28, 2024, New Yorker Magazine
Full Episode Notes are located HERE. They include related episodes, articles, and more.
LAURA FLANDERS & FRIENDS
WHERE DO WE GO FROM HERE?
FRONTLINE ACTIVISTS TALK ELECTION ‘24 TAKEAWAYS
Watch / Listen to broadcast editon or download podcast
NARRATOR: While our weekly shows are edited to time for broadcast on public TV and community radio, we offer to our members and podcast subscribers the full uncut conversation. The following is from our episode, “Where Do We Go From Here? Frontline Activists Talk Election ‘24 Takeaways.” These audio exclusives are made possible thanks to our member supporters.
LAURA FLANDERS: Tens of millions of Americans cast their ballots in one of the most divisive elections in our lifetime and brought us here, a blowout comeback for Donald Trump and the MAGA right. So what happens next? What are the teachings and takeaways from this historic election season, and what lies ahead, the people, the planet, and the American Democratic Project. On November 6th, we are gathered with a group of thinkers and doers to help us think through this moment and consider next steps. Joining me are Guerline Jozef, founder and executive director of the The Haitian Bridge Alliance, which is the only Haitian American led organization serving migrants at the US Mexico border, Judith LeBlanc, a citizen of the Caddo nation and executive director of the Native Organizers Alliance, and Serena Sebring, executive director of Blueprint North Carolina, a progressive ecosystem of nearly 60 groups working to build inclusive democracy in that state. Where do we go from here? Well, first off, I just wanna thank all of you for being with me and everyone here at Laura Flanders and Friends. This was a rough night, and I am happy to be with you today. And I'll start with the question that I often start with to help us sort of land where we are and begin this conversation. And that is who is uppermost in your mind, on your mind, on your heart as we start to talk. Let's start with you, Judith. Who are you thinking about?
JUDITH LEBLANC: I am thinking so much about my grandchildren. I am thinking about the people who've walked on the land where I have been, leading up to the elections, which is the Crow Nation in Montana. And I'm thinking about not only what they were doing, but how they felt when they were doing it. And I'm thinking about my grandchildren, but how they will feel when they look back on the 2024 elections. And in both instances, it it keeps me in balance. It gives me hope.
LAURA FLANDERS: Guerline, what about you? Who's uppermost in your thoughts this morning?
GUERLINE JOZEF: I am thinking about the people whose lives are at risk of deportation, whose the 11,000,000 undocumented people who have been giving everything to this United States, but their future is uncertain. I am thinking of our children. I am thinking of what it might look like for the next 4 years, but the the result that can go beyond that, but I am determined undeterred. I have buckled up my seat belt and I am ready to push forward, but really, really thinking about those less fortunate in in extreme, vulnerability right in extreme, vulnerability right now.
LAURA FLANDERS: Thank you, Guerline. I'm coming to you, Serena. We have followed your work over the last 4 years. I know you have worked your heart out. How's your heart today?
SERENA SEBRING: My heart is with black women today, with myself, with my daughters, with my partners, with my neighbors. And and I think as Caroline said, steadfast, steadfast, steadying and breathing this morning. You know? It is it is our work, but it is also our lives, that we're making sense of this morning as we wake up. And I'm, of course, thinking of my children, and my community. There's a lot to be proud of today too. And so I think I wake up with a mixed bag of emotions. My first thought was, I don't trust anybody who knows the right thing to say today, and I hope nobody expects that of me.
LAURA FLANDERS: Fair enough. And and may I echo that emotion? Let's pick up where you started, Judith, which is what did happen in this election. Not just what happened, but how it happened and the energy and emotion that went into so much of it. You referred to the struggle in Montana. North Carolina was in play, a swing state, for the first time for Democrats in years, and we saw some extraordinary efforts, that will, with any luck, last organizers put organizers in good stead for the future. But are there stories you wanna share about how this campaign was waged by the people that you worked with? Judith.
JUDITH LEBLANC: Well, it there's only one thing to say the day after, and that yesterday was a good day. It was a good day, and I told many across the country. We're working in 12 states with over a 160 moccasins on the ground for the last 2 months. I said, everybody enjoy this day because we are reaping all of the good things and the good feelings among our people, and we're gonna give a snapshot to the world, really, about who our people are. The endpoint, though, is that organizing is our medicine. It's our medicine was our medicine yesterday, and it is our medicine today. That hasn't changed. And I saw in our works over the last 2 months in these 12 states on Indian reservations, rural areas, and in urban areas that the native power that we have been leveraging under the Biden Harris administration is still rising, that we have much to be proud of because of the structural and very real reforms that we made happen under the Biden Harris administration, and that we are going to be building on those experiences. My I I just would end by saying, I'm very realistic that there that the right wing ideology has influenced this sector of my community. And so we have a lot of work to do, but I will quote one person. It's good work. It's hard work. It's joyful work.
LAURA FLANDERS: We'll come back to some of the challenges that were faced in the process, but I thank you for starting us there. What about you, Serena? An extraordinary day in North Carolina by all accounts. No question.
SERENA SEBRING: Extraordinary. I mean, we saw record turnout over and above the records that were already set in 2020. We saw record turnout across every demographic in our state, every corner, even the the counties, the 25 particularly impacted by, the storm, Helene. North Carolina voters were unstoppable. They faced tremendous odds, intimidation at the polls, misinformation, a new process of voter ID, long lines, and we saw them show up again and again in record numbers. We did our very best, it's team justice, to support them. I'm so proud of our team. And by that, I mean our staff, but also this team justice that came together over the last, well, 4 years to prepare for this moment. We are, in fact, bigger, stronger, more tightly knit together, and we know how to collaborate and work under the harshest conditions. And so I have some hope, but also just a tremendous amount of pride to be in this state of a 100 counties of hometown heroes who believe in our power.
LAURA FLANDERS: Guerline, coming to you, one of the big fears going into the night was that people who might fear that they would be perceived as immigrants would not dare to vote because of the threats, that were articulated in the run up to the election. What did you actually see there at the Bridge Alliance?
GUERLINE JOZEF: What we saw within the Haitian American community, but specifically around black immigrant immigrant communities around, the country, we saw people really started to get ed ed, ed, and they were really hopeful that they will not have to deal with the aftermath of the elections. We saw a lot of hope. We saw a lot of vigor. But throughout the night I started seeing texts and messages of people feeling discouraged, but we also saw people giving them booster saying no please don't be discouraged, this is just another step in the fight. And now as we are looking into the United States, specifically as black people and black immigrants, how are we going to move forward? The the level of of potential harms that is staggered around black immigrants, around Haitian immigrants. And we saw days leading to the elections, how they doctored, fake videos to show, you know, undocumented Haitians, going to vote. And we understand very clearly that we are in, in a time where we need to bring our communities together. This is the time that myself, Serena, Judith and others, no matter what our home base is to come together and really push, forward our lives depends on it. Our ancestors deserve it. Our, next generation deserve it. I will be honest with you, Laura. What I saw prior to to the elections, how people were hopeful and what I watched during the night, how hopes were up and down and the stress that came with that. And I was calling to check on folk that I know were really engaged. They were literally in their beds crying. And then I will tell them, get up. Pick yourself up. This is the time that we wipe our eyes. We keep moving, and we reach across the aisle. We reach across to our neighbors. We reach across to different communities. We reach across the native, indigenous folks. We bring our force together, and and we I mean, honestly, we are hopeful for what we are going to accomplish to fight against anything that is creating to divide us.
LAURA FLANDERS: Some of the things that you've mentioned, of course, weaponized, deep fake videos, social media will come in for a lot of of analysis and criticism in the years to come. I don't know about control, but we'll we'll talk about that. Another thing that concerned many of us was threats of violence. And we did see well, according to Timothy Snyder's Substack, a serious problem of Russian instigated bomb threats. Not real bombs, not no real violence, but threats. In 5 states, no fewer than 32 polling stations in Georgia. And in Arizona, in Navajo country, apparently, 4 sites targeted with these threats. Again, just threats, but, suggesting a serious problem. Judith, did you follow any of that? Was that significant? Do you feel like that's something that we should be paying attention to?
JUDITH LEBLANC: I think one of the characteristics of the last 4 years since the last Trump administration has been, traumatic escalation of threats. Not political violence, but the threat of violence, and that is enough to suppress the vote. That is enough to to disrupt the organizing that is so necessary. And the phone threats, when you look at where they were called in, on Navajo, in Arizona, in Georgia
LAURA FLANDERS: Philadelphia. Other places.
JUDITH LEBLANC: Exactly, where black and native voters were the margin were the with were the Margin of victory for either side. And the truth is that we have to understand that those are the kinds of disruptions that we will face not only in the next 4 years, but we've always faced that. You know, it's not a new phenomenon. But but I think that community safety and how we organize to help people stay in balance, to walk as the Navajo say in beauty, where you're 360 degree aware. We have been living that. We have been living like that, but now we have to be even more discerning because the politics of division will not go away until this system is a much more deeply democratic and economic system. In on Navajo, for example, for defiance, we got calls early in the morning saying there were no paper ballots. Then we started getting calls in Apache County. That was the decisive county where we had a 60% voter turnout in 2020. And the Navajo Nation took had to take action, file a lawsuit for emergency remedy, and then those bomb threats started coming in. So when you're outside on Navajo in this time of year, it is cold. And people were standing and we were people all over Indian country, no matter what state, heard about it, saw it in social media, and emergency calls are put out to go to those lines in Apache County, which are very remote, and bring blankets and food. And to me, that shows the power of our organization.
LAURA FLANDERS: Serena, one of the fears that we heard raised the last time we spoke with you and your colleagues in North Carolina was that we would you would see the threat of political violence in the form of armed militia, Proud Boys at polling stations, that kind of thing. Did that did those threats materialize, that effort at intimidation?
SERENA SEBRING: Not in the way that they did in 2020. So we saw a different kind of threat at the polls. There were certainly threats of violence. We heard, through the the the hotline results, of voters who were threatened with physical violence in line, but also just aggressive electioneering. And we move in a time of political violence. So for many voters, it was difficult to tell the difference between, you know, fervent, electioneering and, when there was a white supremacist threat. And, unfortunately, that's maybe because there's not much difference between the 2 in this time. But I think, you know, we also saw the lessons that we learned in 2020 about how to keep ourselves and our community safe really pay off. So when Judith talks about community bringing food and blankets, we saw some some of that same beauty of community show up across the state with DJs, choirs that came out and sang to voters in line, all manner of fish plates and macaroni and cheese that were, shared in in the counties where we knew there would be long lines, and and also the best of us show up at the polls to wait in those lines.
LAURA FLANDERS: Well, we're gonna talk just a little bit more about threats, and then we're gonna get to how do we address, what do we move do to move forward, and what are some of the learnings. But I do have to ask you, Guerline, you and your organization was part of a citizen's lawsuit against Trump and Vance, around those accusations of Haitian immigrants in the Springfield, Ohio area. What happens to that lawsuit now? Can you tell us any more about it? And are you personally concerned for your and your organization's safety?
GUERLINE JOZEF: Laura, we have been under extreme attack since the whole thing began with Ohio and understood very clearly that the the whole story was created to to destabilize, the moment. We did file a criminal complaint against both, former president, Trump and senator Vance for the level of, potential hate crimes that we saw starting in Springfield, Ohio, where they had bomb threats almost every day. They were forced to close their schools. Children were afraid to be in school. They were close to put hospitals and banks in high alert. So we did step up and we we we did, file the complaints because we clearly understood that no one is above the law. And people with extreme power, must be held accountable especially when it comes to extremely vulnerable populations. So as of right now, we are continuing to see what what is next, and we are going to continue, to hold people with extreme power accountable, because there is no other way to do that. We clearly understand that as we are moving forward to, president Trump, investigated in, Vince administration, what that will look for us as a community where we were forced to close our offices. We were forced to pull down our hotlines. We were doxed, both personally and as a community and and and, the the organizations. We had congressional members, in in in Louisiana making extreme violent, comments, not only about the community, the organization, but us as people saying that if Trump wins, we need to pack up. I cannot say the words that they use, but we need to pack up and leave the country before January 20, 2025. But this is my country. As a black woman in America, I know how to fight. And and as a descendant of freedom fighters, that is what I am ready for. So, yes, the fear is real. Yes. The threats coming from people who hold extreme power, is will. However we stand we stand strong and we'll push back against against that. We clearly understand Laura that no matter who is in the White House they're not coming to save us. We have to fight to save ourselves. It could have been easier depending on the outcomes, but I'll be honest with you. The fight for freedom, the fight for, continued, dignity and compassion. That's what we that's what we are fighting for. We are fighting for compassion. We are fighting for justice. We are fighting for dignity for all people. And one thing we also said is that we understand in the United States, we do not have an immigration problem. We have a problem with black and brown immigrants, because, within a Trump made it clear during his first term that he did not want people coming from Haiti and Africa and other countries, And he will welcome people from Norway who happens to be broad hair, blue eyes. So we clearly understand where we stand. That's why we must come together to push again, those false, decisive narratives, and and stand on justice and and stand on love. Our fight is for love. Our fight is for compassion and dignity.
LAURA FLANDERS: For people that don't know what the term doxing, what does it really mean, Guerline?
GUERLINE JOZEF: Doxing is when, they peeves people will put your life at risk. They will publish your home address, and they will tell people if things don't go certain way, they know where to go. So so that created a lot of fear within the community. Our our staff, our teams were afraid to even go to work. That that's how serious it was. So we have to gear up for potential attack, but we we know that, now that we are moving into the new administration, that common sense will will actually be brought forth and that we can continue to do our work. But our staff is under attack, and they are fearful. So we are really asking for everyone to join us in making sure that our community is protected.
LAURA FLANDERS: So we have about, 10 more minutes max, and we need to address 2 different things. This is a frontline activist group, and I I appreciate that your work is not at the level of political punditry and at the level of party politics. But I do want each of you to address what you would be your message perhaps to the Democratic party, drawing on your, you know, conclusions from from this election. And then I wanna talk about this question of political violence, the climate that we'll be in starting next year, the difference that it poses or doesn't, and what are some of the tactics that have been used globally and around the world and in this country, to nonetheless build towards democracy, build bring people together, and to make those who wield the threat of political violence pay a price for that. We've had some discussion of that on the show. There are some clear lessons to be drawn from other countries. All is not lost as you've all said so beautifully. But first off, advice to Democrats. Serena.
SERENA SEBRING: I would say listen to this moment. Take it in, really, really, and let's learn from it. Let's learn what we invested in, what opportunities were missed, and what we can do differently, for more of us together next time. I think that this is and just to be honest, this is a this is a mixed moment in North Carolina. Right? We did see a a a crisis averted at the level of our governor. And so so I I don't want to lose that as as much as we have to acknowledge, the impact of a Trump victory at the presidential level.
LAURA FLANDERS: Yeah. So Josh Stein, the former attorney general, will be the 1st Jewish governor of North Carolina.
SERENA SEBRING: Yes. And and what we did not do was was elect the mini Trumps that were, that were slated at some points in this race to win both our governor's office and our state superintendent's office. And those are victories of the people, but the Democratic party should listen to what the people in North Carolina and the South are saying and not play this swing state game again because I think we can see it did not work.
LAURA FLANDERS: Yeah. Judith.
JUDITH LEBLANC: I would say organizing is our medicine. It's our medicine in Indian country. It's, it's the medicine all across Turtle Island. The Democrats have to learn about what real organizing is. It's about relationship building. And politics and elections are not an inside game. You know, the Democratic Party runs campaigns as though it's an inside game. It's not. We're talking about moving majorities. And if the Democratic party cannot it does not rely on the organizers who we represent to move majorities, they're gonna be losing on and on and on.
LAURA FLANDERS: Guerline?
GUERLINE JOZEF: You know, as an independent voter and and this could be understand that the the, organization I represent is is completely nonpartisan, and and we don't do anything regarding politics per se, other than holding people accountable. But one thing I will say as an, as an independent voter, I think that, the democratic party continues to take our votes for granted, continues to take immigrate immigrants votes and black votes and indigenous votes and and and people of color's vote for granted. And as, Judith mentioned, they are not valuing our organizing. They are not really investing in local organizing to make sure that people are where they need to be. So I do pray that this is a lesson learned and that they understand that our votes really matter and that taking us for granted cannot continue to be the norm. So as we move forward, we do hope that they center those realities that it's it's it's it's really, you know, if you look at how it has been going on, especially for immigrant communities, we have always been taken for granted. You don't have any other choice, but 2. Right? So this this is definitely, a lesson learned, and we do hope that they will change how they're moving forward, and and really understanding how crucial independent voters are and how critical that local communities, underserved communities, they need to address the needs of those communities. Not just come when they need the vote, but really address our issues.
LAURA FLANDERS: And Oprah alone won't do it for you. Let's close with next steps. I'm thinking of what Maria Stephan and others have written and said on our program about what has happened in other countries that have emerged from autocracy, have beaten back autocratic regimes, Chile, South Africa, the list goes on. They talked about bringing exposure to threats locally, to to refusing to buckle under, humanizing victim victims, telling the stories of of who is suffering in this moment, mobilizing diverse coalitions, the more diverse, the better, and using boycotts and other perhaps economic means to exert, a a price on those who, deploy violence and threats. Also, amplifying facts countering disinformation. Those are the sort of five basics that they've been laying out. We will certainly go back to looking at that reporting. But what would be your next steps? Judith, let's start with you.
JUDITH LEBLANC: The next steps are very, very clear. Number 1, we we must recognize and lift up and honor everything that we've done up until yesterday. That's a first step, to be aware of the power that we hold when we're organized. The second next step is to put can to contextualize political violence or the threat of it. Violence will not solve the complicated political problems we face in the 21st century. Pure and simple. And that takes a lot of spiritual and political discipline. That means that we cannot adopt the tactics of those who seek to oppress, suppress us. We cannot adopt the tactics of the system. And thirdly.
LAURA FLANDERS: Guerline. Oh, go quick.
JUDITH LEBLANC: And thirdly, 50 state strategy, organizing in all the states.
LAURA FLANDERS: Guerline, 30 seconds.
GUERLINE JOZEF: Get back to the basics. Priority prioritize people's needs, and center the realities impacted populations. Completely agree to everything that Judith, mentioned, but understanding that our North Star is justice. Our North Star is love and compassion, and so we are ready to move forward in that direction.
LAURA FLANDERS: Serena?
SERENA SEBRING: I I think that our next step has to be assessment, has to be a real careful study of what exactly happened in this cycle, and and not a rush to reaction and and not a a let's lie down and and give up the ghost. Like, we we have to and we are capable of learning and growing stronger in this moment. And I think that's what we must do and take our time to do that.
LAURA FLANDERS: Finally, we ask at the end of every episode of Laura Flanders and Friends what we think the story will be that the future tells of this moment. All I feel as if turning point is perhaps an overused phrase, but let me ask you. What do you think is the story the future will tell of now, Guerline?
GUERLINE JOZEF: I I think that the future might say that we were not ready for a woman of color, to lead us into the next step, which is very unfortunate. I think that the future will tell us to refocus our priorities. I, I do believe that history will, will, will, judge us harshly, especially when it comes to, to our children, the next generation LGBTQ in other people who are fighting for a better life. But I also believe that there are possibilities that that are coming up in in how people can change. I believe in the power of change. I believe in not being discouraged. I believe in possibility. So I believe that the future is still bright, and we might have to work 10 times more, but the future is still bright.
LAURA FLANDERS: Thank you. Serena.
SERENA SEBRING: I think that the future will look back, and and hold us accountable. And I I welcome that. I know that we, in my partnership on my staff and myself, did the best. We brought our very best here. And so all we can learn is about how we can bring more. And I believe that the future will see that we have learned lessons and grown stronger over time.
LAURA FLANDERS: Judith, you get the last word.
JUDITH LEBLANC: The story will be about resilience. It will be a story of how we face difficulties, and our power began to rise. Our strength, our spiritual belief systems guided us to look to the horizon for the strategic way to get there. We will use discernment, and discernment breeds resilience.
LAURA FLANDERS: Judith LeBlanc, Serena Sebring, and Guerline Jozef, thank you so much all of you for joining me.
NARRATOR: Thanks for taking the time to listen to the full conversation from our episode, Where Do We Go From Here? Frontline Activists Talk Election ‘24 Takeaways. For more information on this episode, check out our show notes posted at patreon.com/lauraflandersandfriends. These audio exclusives are made possible thanks to our member supporters. Please consider joining our members now by making a one time donation or make it monthly. All the details are at lauraflanders.org. Thanks again to all our member supporters, and thanks for listening.